On Selling Prints

[DrngdKreationz]

Hey Everyone, I'm not sure how appropriate this is to ask, but I figured It wouldn't hurt. I gave my Girlfriend a print she had wanted as a christmas present and in order to keep it secret I kept the framed print in a small conference room at the office. As the days counted down to Xmas, I was constantly being asked why I didn't actively sell prints. which of course got me thinking that same question. which I came up with the following answers:

Costs of printing/Framing (larger prints)
Quantity of prints to Produce (Unique, limited runs, Sell on Demand?)
Which images to even attempt to sell (Would people really buy the snapshot of my left shoe? lol)
Price Points (what would be a reasonable, yet profitable price point)
Avenues to sell it in (Where, and how to reach a target market)

Now, I'm not planning on quitting my day job any time soon so profitability is just on the goal of allowing one print to pay for the production of the next one... or eventually to have the gear pay for itself if/when I need to upgrade.

I think I humored the idea of selling stock photos until I started reading the business model of the stock websites. I'm not saying I feel my images are worth thousands... but I feel uneasy about people purchasing a composition of mine for a dollar or two.

Well, let me get to the point before I continue rambling.

Would it be OK with the community here, If I were to select, say, 5 images and post them in this thread for an opinion of whether or not they are marketable as wall art and what a reasonable price point should be for the image?

I did a bit of research and found I could produce an 11x14 (or sizes close to that) matted and framed for about $20 USD. and I found places that are willing to give a bit of wallspace to get me started. So I'm giving this some honest thought and consideration... But wanted to reach out for any advice about selling work before I made my next move.

I hope this is ok with you.
Thanks in advance
Carlos

[Simon]

and where these images I'm sure no one would mind too much on seeing your work in any case

[habakuk]

Carlos. Sure we will be happily discuss your selection of photos. I was investigating similar questions recently and got very mixed results. And I mean VERY mixed results indeed.

Depending on the goal you have with exposig your work in a commercial context, the stock photo options most often are not very interesting and they won't help you getting your name out to those that might be your target audience.

I for myself am not interested in selling my shots to web- and add-desgners for a a few bucks, I'm rather going the artist route... and this means: you need to be self confident enough to not sell your work for that low prices. I decided to find me a decent reseller and try to spread my name that way. The other rout is to have a decent webpage where people can order prints.

I'd be happy to discuss this matter with you, and I am sure others will be interested to read that too.

cheers
®

[habakuk]

Ahh... and one more thing. I don't know if you have any comparable services in your area, but you might want to check out the german online gallery "www.whitewall.com" - they present selected artwork, framed and printed in very good quality. They handle everything, from running the site, printing, framing, delivering and handle the payments. Of course the fee I get is only in the range of 20-30% of the price tag of my work, but this is roughly what I learned is reasonable if your work with a real world gallery.

Their service also means there is someone with a well known name (Lumas Gallery) which features a good handfull of my pictures. Having such a gallery select my pictures alone is worth a good share of the price, and they do a lot of PR for me...

cheers
®

[Simon]

I tried making my own website www.simons-photography.com but have never actually had someone send me an email or comment on the pictures as orderly and categorized and uniform as it looks it is all hand written HTML and not a template or anything nopepad is my webpage creator. I tried online stock, well one site was so particular on qulaity issues they failed to see that I had unique images hardly anyone else would bring to them another just regected good images and took the worst the only one I found to be a good compromise and receptive to coments (on one occasion I had quite an email descussion on why my image was rejected and it got passed) they are big stock photo and only recently have introduced a system where you pay between 1 - 6 credits according to image res, I had 50 Mp images going for 2 credits whereas now they are 6 credits but admited its not like makig me a living or a name I've made 7.5 dollars in over a year.
I've pondered the possibility of selling prints but well I can't pay out for a stool or something or a display place I don't think it would pay off. another good option is red bubble they sell prints in varios form and sizes and you can choose your percentage.

[habakuk]

Well, I sold a few pictures for a good price. Like a few 40*60cm (16*23") prints on pro paper for SFr. 200-300 ($180-270), a few pictures of the same format including nice framing and high quality glass (Mirogard) for around Sfr. 500 and a handfull big ones from 60*80cm to 50*120cm panoramas.

Almost all pictures have been sold after exhibitions of my work. But my website played a important role in the process. They learned to know my work in the exhibitions, but the websit gave them the opportunity to see more and have a second look at home. That's why I am still working on a updated, dynamic website for ordering prints...

cheers
®

[Simon]

my problem is I have little knowledge of webdesign and don't know how I would take payments my only seling option is by 3rd party websites

[habakuk]

If you want to sell pictures, then you probably have to invest a bit and let someone create you a website that suggests a professional context for the artwork. Otherwise your site will just be one of millions of others trying to sell some items. If you do exhibitions and people learn to admire your art there, the website might have a lesser impact, tho.

cheers
®

[Simon]

well I haven't the resources to sundenly launch myself not at the moment anyhow

[DrngdKreationz]

Hey guys, Thanks a bunch and sorry for my delayed response as well. My work schedule got turned upside down after the holidays ended, but things are a little bit back to normal so I have time. As for my goal, It's just to have some of my images framed and hanging in the walls of homes or business of others (that aren't family or being paid for out of my own pocket). I'm not worried about making front page news, or to be in a gallery in New York nor a museum (yet). I simply want to take the steps necessary in having photography pay for itself and if a profit begins to build, I will be thankful for it and redesign my goals from there.

This is the image that started the conversations about selling my work and I will post the other handful that I was pondering about selling when I get home tonight.

[Simon]

thats a very nice image, just a pity you have that foreground intrusion, but a very nice subject and you put the background nicely out of focus

[habakuk]

Carlos. It's impossible to predict how successfull a shot will be on the market - we can only guess how "mass compatible" some shots are, or what segment of customers might be interested in that kind of pictures.

Here's my very personal judgement:
With this shot, I think we are in the range of nature photography, and not so much in the realm of "art". To me, it is not abstract or surprising enough to pass as a picture that someone will pay big bucks under the name of buying "art". I'd say this is a shot that needs one or two compagnion pictures and then be sold as a trilogy, nicely placed on black matte and framed properly. Then, it's a shot that I guess will find it's lovers for the quality of the colors. The shot itself has, imho, some "flaws" like the cut off top of the flower, the rather unbalanced framing with the darker green elements and the coverup of the red flower in the lower left corner.

Now... to move it into the realm of "art" (and get more bucks per square inch ) I suggest to crop the shot right in the middle of the red plant and use the right half of the shot!

I think you should find two more shots that have similar strong color contrast, but different color combination and plan to sell them together as a trilogy.

cheers
®

[Simon]

yea always make sure you don't "cut" a subject or frame it too closeley, I've seen shots in competitions where people have tried to isolate a subject from a non disirable surrounding and have croped it so close that it don't look nice, thats a very interesting flower though if its not common around your area it might score a bit better thana more casual flower but as habakuk said a set of three might be more tempting it will mean justification for a bigger price and the client feeling he/she got value for money

[eob]

When trying to sell your images as art, you must always simplify and distill them to most basic visual elements. Casual approach doesn't cut it. As others observed, there's too many accidental flaws, like very busy surroundings, too tight cropping and not a very interesting lighting.

If this kind of a flower is not an endangered/protected species, I would rather cut it down and show it - for example - on the background of a uniform, but textured and stuccoed, wall of a rustic house. Or something like that...

[Ted Byrne]

PRICE POINT

And now to the most engaging topic of all: how to price your work!

I cling to my amateur standing. I am NOT a professional photographer, in that I do  not make my living or any useful part of it from photography. But, I sell images, mostly to pay for bigger hunks of the cost of doing imagery. How did I come to understand my price point?

Very simple, through charity. There are a number of important charitable organizations throughout a 200 mile radius of my home which have annual auctions of donated art. I donated on a regular basis... still do. At first I donated framed prints. Now I donate without the frames (or sometimes just the inexpensive snap together frames from an art supply store). BTW... it makes no sense to invest in expensive frames for the affluent market, they will want frames consistent with their interior design and simply scrap yours in most cases.

At any rate, some years back I was unknown as a photographer (although I am a member and/or on the board of some of these philanthropies - which made it a tad easier to get early acceptance). But even then, many were juried and quality images can make it through that screen, particularly when they are donated. In this country, BTW, the eventual price of the good at auction becomes a tax deduction which usually covers my cost plus.

At any rate, over the years the auctions both resulted in increasing interest in my work beyond the charitable market, while garnering increasing prices. Those prices plus fifty percent formed my price point (the fifty percent is to convince both the donors and the charity that they are getting a bargain through their work), at least for the size of the image donated. For bigger images I  multiply the base price by three times the multiple in size of the base print - or whatever the market can bare... but this is the base point from which I determine the marketability of an image. Hence a $150 8X10 when blown up to 16X20 and is offered at $450.... 48X60 is offered at ((6X150)X3)) $2,100.

In fact my base has increased beyond $150, but you get the idea? As you can see then, I allow the market, through auctions, to determine my pricing and not fear that I will be pricing myself out of interest when prices go up.

I do not work through galleries, and in fact turn them down unless the show is somehow related to a charitable function. Galleries will take between 50 and 65% of the gross and I have to do everything on consignment, meaning I tie up my time and finances until/unless the images sell (plus usually a wait of 30 days). On the other hand, galleries will invest in marketing and that means marketing you. It is nice to have someone else doing that plus associating their name with yours (particularly when their name is known and yours isn't).

All of this of course allows me to know what to charge when people ask for a print. Have I offered limited runs on a series? Only once. Would I? Sure... and I'd keep the run to no more than six. Why? Because I am not presumptuous enough to think that I will ever sell more than five of any print (Probably I should keep the run to two)... and I will always want to keep the right to print one for myself, hence five will surely saturate the external market.

Thoughts?